Warum riecht verbranntes PE und PP nach Plastik?
Ich habe allgemeine Chemie / Physik – Kenntnisse aus einem Bayern Abitur der 80er Jahre.
Dennoch kann ich mir folgendes Phänomen nicht erklären:
Auf fast jedem Joghurtbecher und anderen Verpackungen aus PE oder PP wird groß damit geworben, dass das Zeug angeblich vollständig zu H2O und CO2 verbrennt.
Wenn dem so ist: Warum riechen dann brennende PE Verpackungen nach verbranntem Plastik. Das sollte ja – der Logik folgend – eigentlich geruchsfrei bleiben.
Kann mir jemand sagen was da wirklich für Stoffe entstehen bei der Verbrennung bzw. wo mein Denkfehler liegt.
Danke für Euere Mühen und Euer Engagement.
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Hello, Muscle rider,
First of all, I have to say that there is no smell of burned plastic at all. Every plastic smells different and clearly!
Then I’ve never seen the text on a yogurt cup that burns it cleanly. These are usually made of PS which burns differently than PE and PP alone because of the aromatic structure.
But now on your actual question. Start a piece of PE and pour it out and then rub it carefully. You’ll notice it smells as if you’d blow a candle. Because the paraffin of the candle cannot be distinguished chemically from the PE apart from the chain length.
In PP, the structure is somewhat different but depending on the type you can notice a weak smell of candle here.
If we come to an incineration now you have to consider the conditions again. A controlled combustion with the right conditions actually produces only CO2 and H20 and would thus be without odor. It is the same as wood, it burns properly you have hardly any pain burning it badly tormented and stinks it. Since you have probably only lit a small piece and it has burned short, the combustion will probably have been too cold for a complete implementation. As a result, the usual suspects are also found in a flickering candle or moist wood: CO, PAKs, ……
Funny. In which country do you live? With us here in Germany, yogurt mugs are usually made from PP so polypropylene. I’ve never seen yoghurt cups from Styropor (PS). Maybe that’s different in Styria… maybe thinking before you clean up “qualified” answers…?
That’s a bad joke now?
The standard yogurt cup is deep-drawn and made of PS in D.
https://www.muellermilch.de/actions/biops
https://de.openfoodfacts.org/product/4009700035684/fruit-less-s%C3%BCss-danone
I guess you’ve never looked or looked. no idea?! You have no idea of plastics you didn’t work in plastic processing and now you want to tell me to think about before I give an answer??
Better get your own nose and stop burning your garbage and throw it in the right ton.
ps: If you prefer to buy PP cups then do not wonder about the smell as PA is incorporated here as a barrier that smells after burned horn and produces wonderful pollutants such as HCN.
PE and PP are plastics, of course they smell when burning even after plastics.
And you smell not only finished reaction products when burning. You smell the process with its intermediates, etc. And under, I call it normal conditions, the reaction does not always go through to the end as to how to see residues. In addition: additives.
Your mistake of thinking lies in the type of combustion process – you just ignite it like this, there will always be unbrained parts, well to recognize on the soot flag, but these are then polycyclic hydrocarbons which smell accordingly, you have to “afterburn” these parts.
Burning is not burning.
The combustion process must take place at higher temperatures than in the self-test with ignition of a cup.
Can you name a minimum temperature – above which the combustion takes place more or less completely?
In our waste incinerations the temperatures are about 1100° – 1200° C.
When exactly PE burns without residue, I don’t know. It is formed at 170° C. So somewhere between 170° and 1100° C.
Complete and incomplete combustion.
In the waste incineration there is a chance of complete incineration and with you on the living room table it will coke around.
Well. My experiments are not just on the living room table, but in the fireplace – at estimated 550 ° Celsius plus X ….
okay, from someone who wants to profile himself as a healer, I also do not expect a great consideration for the environment and human being. you have fallen through
You burn plastic waste in the fireplace?
…why?
What are you like? First, ALL medical practitioners burn plastic in the oven. Secondly, you will see how many people in the coming winter will burn everything possible in the oven. As long as there is something that is burning (due to the Europe-wide action “Frieren für Selenzki”). And then I can calm you down: I didn’t fail, but I have the permission as a healer: if you have so much courage to send me an email address, then I will send you a copy of my HP permit.
You have an incomplete burn. You need at least one flue gas burning as in a modern wood stove.