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Nussbecher
2 years ago

For me only and only the decision of the pregnant woman.

BillyShears
2 years ago

“The dignity of man is inviolable,” according to the decision of the Federal Constitutional Court, already intervenes with the idation of the egg for just those.

dieLuka
2 years ago

https://www.bmfsfj.de/bmfsfj/themes/family/pregnantity-and-children’s request/pregnantity termination/pregnancies termination-by-218-strafgesetzbuch-81020

https://www.familieplanung.de/pregnantial conflict/pregnancies abort/pregnant-law-indications-and-terms/#c5918

Basically, I find it good that there is the option in the background danger for the mother. Here the person who lives and is able to decide must also decide whether to risk their own life. I am indecisive about the aspect of mental health of the mother.

I also find it good that the option of pregnancy consists of violent crimes. There, pregnancy is potentially an emotional burden that cannot bear everyone and could not have the possibility of abortions lead to despair.

I think it is good and important that, in other cases, it should be consulted. the consequences must be due to talks with people who are not directly affected (in contrast to the becoming father, parents or parents of the father) and who, if necessary, want to push into one direction or another.

In principle, without the option of legal abortion, I would see a higher risk of abortion tourism or home attempts with possibly corresponding consequences for mother’s health without added value.

Darkjar350
2 years ago

It’s been allowed for a few days. So I’m voting against the law that’s been returned a few years ago. It’s just my permission.

Elli113
2 years ago
Reply to  Darkjar350

?

Abortion is not permitted in any country of Europe.

Mayahuel
2 years ago

Why should something within a body (Fötus) have more rights than something (child) outside?

A child cannot ask his mother to donate a kidney. Or ask for a stem cell donation from her. It may have its own body free: even if the child dies in a refusal.

Theme in religion.

The Bible does not mention abortion.

Practices for the abortion of the fetus were widespread in the Greek-Roman antiquity. Nevertheless, abortion in the Bible is not mentioned:

The word “abortion” is not mentioned in the Bible, but much in the Bible speaks to the issue. The most obvious passage is from Exodus 21:22-25.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12178933/

In Exodus 21,22 a man only has to pay a fine if he unintentionally triggers a miscarriage:

22 When men fight with each other and fight a pregnant woman, so that her fruit goes away, but otherwise she does not harm her, he shall be punished for money, how much her husband imposes on him, and he shall give it through the hand of the judges.

https://www.bibleserver.com/LUT/2.Mose21.22

It’s just damages.

This also describes “Jewish agings” by Flavius Josephus:

In favour of this interpretation is the witness of Josephus in the first century AD:

He that kicks a woman with child, so that the woman miscarry, let him pay a fine in money… as having reduced the multitude by the destruction of what was in her womb…but if she die of the stroke, let him be put to death (3)

The same interpretation is evident in the Talmud and has become authoritative in Orthodox Judaism.

https://humanjourney.org.uk/articles/exodus-21-and-abortion/#3-rtn

BillyShears
2 years ago
Reply to  Mayahuel

Why should something within a body (Fötus) have more rights than something (child) outside?

There is never talk of “more rights”.

Mayahuel
2 years ago
Reply to  BillyShears

There is never talk of “more rights”.

Yes.

A child cannot force the mother to donate a kidney (no rights). Mother must have her body.

Fötus can force mother to discharge (has rights). Mother must not have her body.

Friedliebender
2 years ago
Reply to  Mayahuel

If a death occurs, even the child, the man should be brought to death. But if the woman can no longer bear, then the contravene had to make damages.

Anastasia65
2 years ago
Reply to  Mayahuel

Why? more Right? Child death is not allowed even after birth.

Mayahuel
2 years ago
Reply to  Anastasia65

Why more rights?

Can a child ask for a renal donation from his mother?

If no: then the fetus has more rights, because it can determine the body of the mother

Anastasia65
2 years ago

Do not do it, the mother carries her child under her heart, and usually she does this Love. It’s about Love!

Mayahuel
2 years ago

we need to redefine human life!

Nope.

The child is human life and even legally a person: and still cannot have the body of the mother.

Anastasia65
2 years ago

If Not applicable we need to redefine human life!

Mayahuel
2 years ago

If he asks for her kidney, he is definitely not ashamed.

and if the fetus demands the body of the woman: not harmless?

Anastasia65
2 years ago

If the kidney demand, he is definitely not ashamed.

But no matter what:

Is the fetus a child of his mother, or only after birth?

Mayahuel
2 years ago

When Paul says that…

Yes, Paul says so.

the woman’s opponent?

Is the child the woman’s opponent?

Is someone who wants a kidney, the opponent?

Anastasia65
2 years ago

When Paul says that…

Do you see the woman’s opponent in the fetus?

Mayahuel
2 years ago

It’s natural law.

the law of nature that, according to Paul, forbids men long hair?

Anastasia65
2 years ago

It’s natural law.

BillyShears
2 years ago

Then a child should ask the mother to donate stem cells.

No, other construction site. Look at the above basic legal articles, that’ll find it.

And bye.

🙄

Mayahuel
2 years ago

In order to enforce a ban on abortion, it would be sufficient to grant the same rights to a fetus.

Then a child should ask the mother to donate stem cells. I can’t.

a false, hollow phrase.

And bye.

BillyShears
2 years ago

die is also a natural process. Nonetheless, not everyone wants it.

And yet it can’t be prevented. That’s how it is often in nature.

And whether something is natural doesn’t matter.

Really? I’m new.

Forced vaccination is already problematic.

You realize that even you have no arguments for the “more rights” affirmation, because it is simply wrong. In order to enforce a ban on abortion, it would already be sufficient for a fetus to the to grant rights.

This fits perfectly with the keyword of forced vaccination, because the current impunity of abortion and forced vaccination can rely on the same right: GG Article 2(2) sentence 3.

The “more rights” affirmation simply remains a false, hollow phrase.

Mayahuel
2 years ago

a very natural process

die is also a natural process. Nonetheless, not everyone wants it.

and therefore not comparable to a donor.

Oh, yes.

Forced vaccination is already problematic.

BillyShears
2 years ago

he has her body.

He has her body? A pregnant woman is not a zombie controlled by the fetus.

But the fetus is in the mother. In the body of the mother. And without mother not viable.

Exactly, a very natural process and therefore not comparable to a donor.

So where does a fetus have more rights?

Mayahuel
2 years ago

So where does the fetus have more rights?

he has her body. He can force her to discharge.

So not the mother over the body of the fetus.

But the fetus is in the mother. In the body of the mother. And without mother not viable.

BillyShears
2 years ago

you don’t answer my question.

You don’t mean either. But here my answer: No, you can’t, neither a fetus. So where does a fetus have more rights?

then one cannot have the body of another.

So not the mother over the body of the fetus. So where does the fetus have more rights?

Mayahuel
2 years ago

Where is this more right anchored?

you don’t answer my question.

Can you force someone to a stem cell donation?

If no: then you cannot have the body of another.

In the case of a ban on abortion, however, exactly that happens: the fetus has the body of the mother (against its will).

BillyShears
2 years ago

Where is this more right anchored?

Mayahuel
2 years ago

Where is this more right anchored?

can you force someone to a kidney donation?

BillyShears
2 years ago

Where do I find that? Where is this more right anchored? And how does a fetus want to decide?

Mayahuel
2 years ago

Where exactly does the fetus have more rights?

may decide on the body of the woman.

BillyShears
2 years ago

Where exactly does the fetus have more rights?

aviva859
2 years ago

The problem is that there are two important rights: the right to Self-determinationand the right to Life. And while I find self-determination totally important and necessary for women, the right to the life of the unborn person is outweighed here.

You should always be mindful and involve violent crimes or danger to the mother. You can’t make anything about a comb

aviva859
2 years ago
Reply to  aviva859

There should also be enough support for mothers or parents, so that a child’s pregnancy and broadening is not a risk.

Elli113
2 years ago

I’m not “for” abortion. I’m for enlightenment and prevention, so it doesn’t have to be done.

Nevertheless, I can accept that sometimes a woman becomes unintentionally pregnant and, for reasons I have not to judge, wants abortion and then it is also “ok”.

In principle, I do not consider a ban on abortion to be a target.

Just because abortions are forbidden, that doesn’t mean there is no one. They then exist abroad or under medical, or hygienic, questionable circumstances. When the star published his famous “we have driven off” title story in 1971, 374 women have admitted publicly to have driven away even though it was completely illegal in Germany. (Yes, okay, 373 – Alice Schwarzer doesn’t count, she lied, I know).

There are women who just don’t want a child. And sterilization is even more difficult to get for childless women of a childless age than a affordable crib space in the aeration room. Then there is also not even a small number of women who simply cannot afford reliable contraceptives such as pill or spiral. What are they doing? Sustainability, clear. But if they are in a relationship and the partner “requires his right”?

It’s like this: you have a conflict of rights in this issue.

On the one hand, the woman and her rights and on the other is the unborn. In any case where there is a collision of different rights, it is necessary to consider which right weighs harder. A compromise is not possible in abortion.

I personally have a problem with the view that the unborn should be more important than the woman in which it grows. How far are you going? Can pregnant women not drive anymore because this could be dangerous for the unborn? Can pregnant women no longer enter a pub to be protected from passive smoke? How many rights of pregnant women can one limit to protect the unborn maximum?

The often heard argument of abortion opponents “I am against abortion, only when rape is okay” I think it is inconsistent. For if one is against abortion, because life is holy in itself and must in any case be protected, what makes the life of a child born in rape less protective?

To carry out an unwanted pregnancy is probably always quite difficult, even though the woman might have fun during the procreation. The fact that the trauma might potentiate if the procreation has already taken place unintentionally is certainly correct, but does an unwanted pregnancy in itself not more easily attainable.

Either one accepts that women can determine their own body – whether and when they want to have sex with someone just like the fact that they want to carry out an unwanted pregnancy or not – or one does not accept this right of self-determination for women.

I look forward to any unnecessary abortion. But sometimes, for reasons that I do not want to judge, it is the only way for those concerned. And this way should be available legally and under reasonable conditions.

Allyluna
2 years ago

There are countless questions for this – just look over there and look out for the numerous opinions that come out.

Schurzi21
2 years ago

Deportation should be legal everywhere, but only in the early stage and any woman should be able to decide for herself.

gansamwasser
2 years ago

I think the regulation of the so-called time limit solution in Germany is good. In principle, I believe that abortions should not be necessary due to the present possibilities of contraception.

Nussbecher
2 years ago
Reply to  gansamwasser

Tell that to a raped woman.

gansamwasser
2 years ago
Reply to  Nussbecher

Apparently you didn’t understand my answer. Or you don’t want to understand it. I’m very sorry.

GutWetter
2 years ago

I’m a bit split. If the prevention fails, the woman should be allowed to decide whether or not to keep the child. Of course, this also applies to rapes – no woman must be forced to carry a child against her will.

But there are women who get pregnant at the running meter often do not know who, and so repeatedly let abortions take place. Here I would talk about a deadbeat or worse. There are many unintentional childless couples who would let a child grow up in security with much love.

Friedliebender
2 years ago
Reply to  GutWetter

Note what the Bible in 2. Moses 21:22, 23 on the life of an unborn child says: “If men should go up with each other and they really hurt a pregnant woman and their children really go away, but there is no fatal accident, so shall he be put on … damages … But if a fatal accident arises [what affects the mother or the unborn child], then you shall give soul to the soul.” Yeah, killing an unborn child was considered murder.

Although some doctors consider an unborn child merely as a fetus or tissue lump and not as a person, God thinks differently about it. He considers an embryo as an individual, as a living person (Psalm 139:16). Could one discard unborn life and still remain in the favor of God, who gives life to all persons? (Acts 17:25).

Awakened in 1990. 8 May. p. 26-27

aviva859
2 years ago
Reply to  Friedliebender

I agree with you, and even without God’s opinion, a fetus is a stage of development of a human being and no object

GutWetter
2 years ago
Reply to  Friedliebender

Note that not all people believe in your God.

I liberated myself after a strictly religious Catholic education and some harassment from the church about 20 years ago. I really don’t care what this God thinks.

Elli113
2 years ago
Reply to  GutWetter

There are many unintentional childless couples who would let a child grow up in security with much love.

There are not so many. The number of adopted couples has fallen by 40% over the last ten years, because modern reproduction medicine allows many childless couples a physical baby.

GutWetter
2 years ago
Reply to  Elli113

That’s true, there are some couples than 30 years ago. That’s why the “waiting list” on a newborn is shorter than at that time. Which means the demand is there. The meaninglessly driven children could lead a happy life.

GutWetter
2 years ago

You mix numbers with your grds. Opinion on adoption.

I answered the FS, which I would have done with this issue.

Elli113
2 years ago

Yes, much less couples. As I said, demand is falling steadily. And it will continue to fall if, for example, the egg donation is legalized in Germany.

Certainly, in individual cases the release for adoption can be a solution.

But the problem is a quantitative one.

Around 100,000 abortions per year (tent rather falling) come about 1300 foreign ad options. Even if you calculate that there are still 3-5 adoption-willing couples on each adopted child, I don’t have to be a computational genius to realize that the adoption cannot be a general solution.

GutWetter
2 years ago

Auto correction 😡

That’s true, it’s Less Couples give…

GutWetter
2 years ago

Amen

Friedliebender
2 years ago

Firstly, Christians are asked and secondly, that is my opinion.

You are not freed, but by your rejection to please God, become a slave of sin.

Rapunzel324
2 years ago

This is a delicate subject. There are enough ways to prevent gravity. If a woman wants an abortion, that’s her thing as it’s her body. The decision is made by the woman. I personally agree with abortion, especially when there are medical or criminal reasons.https://www.bmfsfj.de/bmfsfj/themes/family/pregnantity-and-children’s request/pregnantity termination/pregnancies termination-by-218-strafgesetzbuch-81020