Are there any communists here who can explain to me how they manage not to consider Marx's theory refuted?

Marx's theory stands or falls with his thesis that history is inevitably moving toward socialism. Otherwise, bringing about the revolution and the sacrifices that would be required for it would be unjustifiable, and the moral core of the ideology would be destroyed.

Now, communism has fallen out of fashion, the theory of impoverishment hasn't materialized, the only systems that have called themselves communist have arisen in agrarian, not industrialized, nations, and the dictatorship of the proletariat has turned out to be the dictatorship of the party (despite Marx's assumption that this was impossible). It also seems as if the revolutions that have already occurred, if anything, were a self-fulfilling prophecy, originating directly from Marx himself and not from a law of history.

Marx's scientific claim, similar to the natural sciences, was to develop a theory and, based on that theory, to make a prediction. He conceived the theory, made a prediction, and the observable consequences contradicted the theory's expectations. Thus, according to Marx's own understanding of science, the theory should be considered refuted, right?

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DiegoderAeltere
1 year ago

You are only criticizing a small part of the theoretical framework of Marxism, and even then only on the basis of distorted representations.

Marx never claimed that history proceeds mechanically and strictly deterministically and that socialism is inevitable. What he did was identify capitalism as an epoch that had a beginning and could therefore also end, and he analyzed the tendencies of capitalism and extrapolated them into the future.

According to Marx, capitalism creates the conditions for socialism (i.e., the management of surplus) through increased productivity. Due to its internal contradictions, it inevitably falls into severe crises that reveal its irrationality (e.g., scarcity due to overproduction) and provide opportunities for the introduction of socialism. In all of this, Marx always emphasized the importance of conscious human action.

Objective factors alone, such as economic crises, do not lead to socialism unless subjective factors, such as a mature and conscious revolutionary subject, are also present.

Now communism is out of fashion

This means nothing more than a weakening of the subjective factor, caused by bloody repressions (in both liberal and fascist states) and the disappointments of the Soviet Union.

the theory of impoverishment has not occurred

The interpretation of the impoverishment theory has always been controversial among Marxists. In the form of relative impoverishment, i.e., the faster growth of profits than wages, it has clearly been fulfilled:

wagescompensation-1200×1093.jpg (1200×1093) (forbes.com)

CH2-F2.3.jpg (2083×1522) (wid.world)

the only systems that have called themselves communist have emerged in agricultural nations and not in industrial nations

That alone is not a contradiction with Marxism. Marx himself had the initial ideas on this topic with the concept of permanent revolution, which was developed into a comprehensive theory by Leon Trotsky, among others. The problem was simply that the revolution remained limited to the agrarian countries and thus had a poor foundation, which enabled the rise of Stalinism.

the dictatorship of the proletariat has turned out to be the dictatorship of the party (despite Marx's assumption that this was impossible)

Marx even specifically warned against this possibility in his "Civil War in France," in which he described the experiences of the Paris Commune and praised its principles that representatives and officials of the revolution received only an average worker's wage and were democratically recallable at any time.

Roland Sperling
1 year ago

Erstens gibt es bei Marx keine Verelendungstheorie.

Zweitens: Schau dich doch in der Welt um: Afrika, die arabischen Länder, Süd- und M;ittelamnerika, Asien, aber auch schon Länder wie Griechenland oder Spanien sind in der Verelendung weit fortgeschritten. Alles kapitalistische Länder!

Picus48
1 year ago

die Theorie der Verelendung ist nicht eingetreten…

Wovon redest Du? Von Deutschland? Auch hier leben unzählige Menschen in Armut, sammeln Flaschen, gehen zu Tafeln und wissen oft nicht, wie sie die Kohle ranschaffen können. Die Kinder leiden, haben vielfach keine ordentliche Verpflegung.

EnisLatskin
11 months ago
Reply to  Chuaynezoon

Die Spanne zwischen Bourgeoisie und Proletariat wird ja immer grösser, wo ist der Widerspruch zu Marx?

Roland Sperling
1 year ago
Reply to  Chuaynezoon

Aber die Reichen werden immer reicher, und die unteren Klassen haben fast nichts. Das ist auch in Deutschland so.

evtldocha
1 year ago

die Theorie der Verelendung ist nicht eingetreten,

… da muss man schon einen sehr eingeschränkten Blick auf die Welt und das in ihr herrschende Elend haben, um das mal so ohne tiefergehenden Blick und einer weitergehenden Analyse und Argumentation einfach mal so zu behaupten.

EnisLatskin
11 months ago
Reply to  Chuaynezoon

Du wirfst mit Lügen und falsch interpretierten Aussagen um dich und wunderst dich, dass darauf reagiert wird?